War Liberal

Racism, maybe. How do you know that the particular folks flying the flag have racism in their family tree?

Treason? Nah. The War of Northern Aggression may have been a good thing or it may have been a bad thing. Depends whether it was your town being invaded. There is no doubt that ending slavery makes sense, but it would have happened with or without a Civil War.

Garbage. The "heritage" they're talking about is the racist heritage of slavery and Jim Crow. Future use of the phrase "War of Northern Aggression" to refer to the treasonous activities of the southern states in the 1860s will be deleted. You can call this "censorship" but it's my site and I'll do what I want.

"The War of Northern Aggression"

In other words: Ha! Ha! I'm using the Internet!!!!!1

Yeah, like when the North came and fired on Ft. Sumter or when the North seceeded and began open war on the United States. Yeah, that Northern Aggression.

Deleted because there's no such thing as an "African Flag", twit. -- MT

Oops, forgot to add...

first visit here... last visit here...

Good. -- MT

Hey Trevor, with you and your "War of Northern Aggression" phrase...you must be living in the same fantasy land as the Civil War re-enactors down here in Alabama. Why in the hell would anyone want to re-enact something over and over again where the end result is that they lose? It makes no sense to me.

Flying the Confederate flag of ANY sort, battle or otherwise, is completely asinine considering we have a flag in this country--the American flag. And flying them together, when that happens, is moronic. To be for the Confederate flag is to be against the American flag. After all, the Union flag, which evolved into the American flag with all 50 states, is the enemy, right? Mac, I'm with you on this 100%, buddy.

"There is no doubt that ending slavery makes sense..."

"Makes sense?" Deciding people shouldn't own other people isn't something you decide by risk/benefit analysis.

"...but it would have happened with or without a Civil War."


Yeah, it was really just a minor policy change we probably would have gotten around to eventually.

Talk about revisionism.

Considering that the South tried to keep blacks as slaves over a hundred years past the end of the "War of Northern Agression," and it took the intervention of the US Marines and almost another war to make them give that up, I seriously doubt the Confederacy was going to give up slavery any time soon.

Yes, treason.

I don't really object to Confederate battle flag so much on grounds of racism. What we call the Confederate flag -- the crossed diagonal stripes -- is really their battle flag, not their national flag. As such, it doesn't really represent their government and its policies (such as slavery); it represents their armies.

Armies that, for the entirety of their short existance, had one function: to fight against the United States of America.

I object to the Confederate battle flag in the same way I would object to any flag -- say, the Nazi or Imperial German flag -- displayed specifically to glorify the period of their nation's fight against the USA.

But a display of the Imperial German flag or the British flag or whatever is probably for some other reason, since those countries had long histories, only a small part of which included war with the USA. So display of those flags is OK by me (unless other context implies that are being displayed specifically to glorify their fight against the USA).

But the entire history of the Confederacy included war with the United States of America. The entire purpose of their armies was ever only to fight the USA.

So displaying the Confederate battle flag is in essence saying "Too bad the USA won that war".

I find this very objectionable.

I really dislike the sort of historic revisionism that always comes up with these things.

Like, for example, the time I had a family member tell me that "slavery wasn't that bad" and that a bunch of liberal history professors had exaggerated it to make the South look racist and bad.

Because as we all know, being forced to pick cotton all day and taking beatings from an overseer is just a walk in the park. Hell, it's better than accounting.

And of course the South isn't racist.

That whole thing with spraying children with the hoses during the civil rights movement was special effects. Ed Wood totally just cranked out that shit with a water gun and some plastic army toys.

But as for this big Confederate flag, I mean, how else are they supposed show they're big of fans they are of Lynyrd Skynyrd and the Vestavia Hills Rebels?

Building a sign that big would just be crazy.

Yeah, I used to buy into that Southern heritage crap too back in the day. Then I grew up. That's not true-- I still have Southern heritage. It just doesn't include the treason and racism represented during the CSA. That's not the Southern heritage, it's the Southern embarassment.

I object to the Confederate battle flag in the same way I would object to any flag -- say, the Nazi or Imperial German flag -- displayed specifically to glorify the period of their nation's fight against the USA.

Just curious if anyone else has thought of this:

I wonder what the reaction would be if someone flew an altered Confederate battle flag with swastikas in place of the stars? Possibly with the words "You lost get over it" on it like the flag created by Jesse Taylor at pandagon*? And flew a big-ass one on private property like the one in the article linked to in this post? Anyone want to hazard a guess? Better yet - anyone want to try it?

* - I can't find the pandagon post where he posted a picture of the stars and bars with the words "You lost - get over it" in white on the red background. But hopefully you get the mental picture...

Why is it that it's always "libertarians" who defend the role of the South in the Civil War?

Because they always think they would have been the slaveowners, not the slaves. Just like the way they defend feudalism, because they think they would have been the lords, not the oppressed peasants whose only (thin) defense was the crown. They're incapable of thinking of themselves as the victims of anything other than the awful central government and its cruel 25 percent taxation.

Hey man, delete what you want. I'm an immigrant Canadian and I still have my doubts about the Civil War.

It's a conundrum. I believe in freedom - even the freedom to display poor taste. Thanks for all the assumptions though.

Slavery would have ended by itself with the advent of technology because it was economically unsustainable.

Please don't bother pointing your fingers and screaming while spewing spittle all over. I'm not supporting racism or slavery.

Mac,

Your assumption that you know what libertarians think about any given topic is a bit of a stretch, since libertarians are some of the most argumentative people on the planet and can't even agree on what to eat for dinner when there are more than three of them gathered together.

There are only two cardinal rules libertarians agree on - force and fraud are wrong.

If you think any successful government can avoid using force, then you are defrauding yourselves.

Well, he is a Libertarian.

man, im from the south, and you liberal, ass, yankees, ain't got a clue what the war was fought about. it was mainly fought over the state's right to secede, and the states had ever right to secede because it says so in our damn constitution, and in decleration of independece. it's called the northern war of aggression because the north started the war, and forced the south back in the USA. some say, that the south started it because we opened fire on ft. sumter. well, if Abraham Lincoln wouldn't have send navy BATTLE SHIPS to the fort to resupplie it, it would have never have happened. also, do you all dumb ass yankees know that Jefferson Davis sent people to the White House to make PEACE with the US before the firing upon ft. sumter, and guess what, Abraham Lincoln REFUSED to even talk to them. you dumb yankees NEED TO GIT YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT. how dare you say the rebel flag is rascits, and evil. its heritage, not hate. and some say, the flag represents as an enemy to the USA. that's bullshit. it represents our family who fought what they believed for, and it does not represent that i believe in slavery. some blacks say slavery is so evil, well for u negros, if it wasn't for slavery, your dumb ass would be in africa right now, straving with all of the african tribes. so u should be thanking the whites for bringing your asses over hear, not spitting on there graves. if u negros feel like suing a white family because there family may have had slaves that were in your family, well i think you should git a one way ticket to africa, since your ancestors were brought here against there own will
LONG LIVE THE CSA

There's no way that's a real rant. It's just too pure and too sublime.

By the way, if your family fought for the CSA, there's a pretty good chance they were either misled about the purpose of the war, or forced to fight against their better judgment. The people who wanted secession generally avoided the actual fighting.